M11 PRO Stainless Steel MQA x8 unfolding support?

ppunji77

I am currently using the M11 PRO SS. My M11 PRO SS has the latest firmware applied. However, in this firmware, MQA X8 unfold is not applied. Why doesn't the M11 PRO SS support all MQA like the M11 PRO or M1?

fgrisi

I'm not sure if the M11 Pro decodes MQA files from third party apps (other than FiiO Music). They say they'll be able to do that in 'future updates'.

Does anyone know if they're already decoding MQA from third parties, like TIDAL?

FiiO

Dear friend,

Yes, global MQA support has been added for M11PRO since FW 1.0.3.

http://www.fiio.me/forum.php?mod ... id=45117&extra=

Please check whether you are playing MQA file and enable the MQA setting in the setting of FiiO Music app.

Best regards

ppunji77

FiiO replied at 2021-1-21 10:21
Dear friend,

Yes, global MQA support has been added for M11PRO since FW 1.0.3.

Yes, I know. But, The M11 PRO SS has not supported fully X8 MQA unfolding.
And, what setting are you talking about in the FIIO MUSIC APP? The only setting related to MQA in FIIO MUSIC APP is the setting related to SPDIF connection. Regarding MQA, M11 and M11 PRO normal support X8 unfold, but M11 PRO SS is not properly supported. Also, the M11 PRO SS is not registered on the MQA website. I regret buying the M11 PRO SS now. It would have been better to just buy the M11 PRO normal.

Aclii

I think it's not absolutely correct from technical perspective to say that M11 Pro and M11 Pro SS are different products. The only difference is case material (stainless steel vs aluminium) and price tag so they are equal in SW and HW. I own M11 Pro SS and have no issue with MQA 8x unfold in FiiO Music or third party apps (tried Tidal some time ago).

ppunji77

Aclii replied at 2021-1-23 06:52
I think it's not absolutely correct from technical perspective to say that M11 Pro and M11 Pro SS ar ...

Of course I know that there is no technical difference and it is just the case material difference. What I would like to contact FIIO is not about technical differences, but about MQA certification processing. If you go to the actual MQA website, there is no M11 PRO SS The introduction of the FIIO sales page is also slightly different. My friends' M11 PRO SS also doesn't support MQA X8 unfolding properly. Even FIIO MUSIC APP does not support MQA X8. If it is MQA X8 unfold, it should support up to 384Khz. This is different from the Normal M11 PRO/ M11.

Aclii

Just took a photo of my M11 Pro SS playing MQA 44.1x8. Could you share a file which works on Pro and doesn't work on Pro SS ?

ppunji77

Aclii replied at 2021-1-24 04:59
Just took a photo of my M11 Pro SS playing MQA 44.1x8. Could you share a file which works on Pro and ...

The song you uploaded is a song released at 352.8Khz on Tidal. Classical albums have many such albums. Songs like this are not x8 unfolded, but are themselves 352.8Khz. I mean, even if it is folded at 44.1Khz or 48Khz and released to tidal, if DAP supports X8 unfold, it will be unfolded to 352.8Khz or 384Khz. In addition to the M11PRO SS, I have 4 more DAPs. Among these, I will show you pictures of other DAPs that support MQA X8 unfold, including the M11 PRO SS.

1.HIBY R6 SS: Fully MQA x8 unfold support : 44.1 X8 =352.8Khz

HIBY R6 SS

2.FIIO M11 PRO SS : Not support MQA x8 unfold : Just 88.2Khz

M11 PRO SS

3.IBASSO DX300 : Fully MQA x8 unfold support : 44.1 X8 =352.8Khz

IBASSO DX300

Aclii

ppunji77 replied at 2021-1-24 08:22
The song you uploaded is a song released at 352.8Khz on Tidal. Classical albums have many such alb ...

Thanks for sharing the photos! Now I got what you mean)

I found similar question here: https://www.head-fi.org/threads/ ... 95449/post-16025219

And statement below interested me:
"When playing MQA tracks, the status bar will display the original sample rates of the MQA track instead of the playing sample rates after fully unfolding, as requested by the MQA licensor."

They indeed posted it here: https://fiio.com/newsinfo/430684.html (section 2.2)

So I decided to check if we can confirm this from device logs (dmesg and logcat) when playing MQA, here are log dumps for different MQA and non-MQA samples:

44100 16-bit regular non-MQA flac:

dmesg:

1. [253448.989172]  [4:     AudioOut_D: 2317] samsung-abox 14a50000.abox: audif clock: 33868800

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logcat:

1. 01-25 00:35:18.475  2247  2317 D FIIO_PENSIR: int aqm_initialise(int, int, int, int): start type:2 outputRate:0 inputSampleRate:44100 upSampleMode;0

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MQA 352.8 original sample rate
dmesg:

1. [253933.759358]  [5:     AudioOut_D: 2317] samsung-abox 14a50000.abox: audif clock: 22579200
   
2. [253933.759381]  [5:     AudioOut_D: 2317] samsung-abox 14a50000.abox: rate=352800, width=32, channel=2, bclk=22579200
   
3. [253933.759461]  [5:     AudioOut_D: 2317] samsung-abox-rdma 14a51000.abox_rdma: abox_request_cpu_gear(ffffffc07463c410, 2)
   
4. [253933.759474]  [5:     AudioOut_D: 2317] samsung-abox-rdma 14a51000.abox_rdma: Playback:DmaAddr=0x00000000f6a80000 Total=122880 PrdSz=3840(30720) #Prds=4 dma_area=ffffff8002314000 rate=352800, width=32, channels=2

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logcat:

1. 01-25 00:33:13.053  2247  2317 D FIIO_PENSIR: int aqm_initialise(int, int, int, int): start type:0 outputRate:3 inputSampleRate:44100 upSampleMode;0
   
2. 01-25 00:33:13.054  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: ============================begin mqa decoder config====================================
   
3. 01-25 00:33:13.054  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.rate:352800
   
4. 01-25 00:33:13.054  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.format:1
   
5. 01-25 00:33:13.054  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.channels:2
   
6. 01-25 00:33:13.054  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.period_size:3840
   
7. 01-25 00:33:13.054  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.period_count:4
   
8. 01-25 00:33:13.054  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.start_threshold:11520
   
9. 01-25 00:33:13.054  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.stop_threshold:-1
   
10. 01-25 00:33:13.054  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.silence_threshold:0
    
11. 01-25 00:33:13.054  2247 21642 E mqa_decoder: mqa_player_loop:begin
    
12. 01-25 00:33:13.054  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.silence_size:0
    
13. 01-25 00:33:13.054  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: ===============================end mqa decoder config=================================
    
14. 01-25 00:33:13.173  2671  2843 D PhoneStatusBar: sampleRateObserver sampleRate=352800
    
15. 01-25 00:33:13.847  2671  2671 D PhoneStatusBar: originalRate=352800 audioType=2

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MQA 96 original sample rate
dmesg:

1. [254013.640554]  [3:     AudioOut_D: 2317] samsung-abox 14a50000.abox: audif clock: 24576000
   
2. [254013.640585]  [3:     AudioOut_D: 2317] samsung-abox 14a50000.abox: rate=384000, width=32, channel=2, bclk=24576000
   
3. [254013.640673]  [3:     AudioOut_D: 2317] samsung-abox-rdma 14a51000.abox_rdma: abox_request_cpu_gear(ffffffc07463c410, 2)
   
4. [254013.640696]  [3:     AudioOut_D: 2317] samsung-abox-rdma 14a51000.abox_rdma: Playback:DmaAddr=0x00000000f6a80000 Total=122880 PrdSz=3840(30720) #Prds=4 dma_area=ffffff8002314000 rate=384000, width=32, channels=2

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logcat:

1. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 D FIIO_PENSIR: int aqm_initialise(int, int, int, int): start type:0 outputRate:3 inputSampleRate:48000 upSampleMode;0
   
2. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: ============================begin mqa decoder config====================================
   
3. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247 21768 E mqa_decoder: mqa_decoder_loop:begin
   
4. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.rate:384000
   
5. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.format:1
   
6. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.channels:2
   
7. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.period_size:3840
   
8. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.period_count:4
   
9. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.start_threshold:11520
   
10. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.stop_threshold:-1
    
11. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.silence_threshold:0
    
12. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.silence_size:0
    
13. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: ===============================end mqa decoder config=================================
    
14. 01-25 00:38:19.345  2671  2843 D PhoneStatusBar: sampleRateObserver sampleRate=384000
    
15. 01-25 00:38:19.856  2671  2671 D PhoneStatusBar: originalRate=96000 audioType=2

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So for MQA files M11 Pro does full x8 unfolding, but FiiO decided to show original sample rate instead of real one for some reason, not sure why Hiby doesn't have this license limitation though)).

ppunji77

Aclii replied at 2021-1-25 08:57
Thanks for sharing the photos! Now I got what you mean)

I found similar question here: https://ww ...

Thank you for your reply and checking.
The reason is simple. It seems to be due to the MQA support license. HIBY officially announced. HIBY R8 and HIBY R6 2020 support X16 unfold, and older versions only support X8. And, according to it, I implemented it through a firmware update. IBASSO also announced that the DX160 is x4 unfold, and the new DX300 released this time has X8 unfold support and is supported as it is. Other companies are also providing support through firmware updates after license acquisition. I think FIIO will be able to fully support fully unfolding through firmware updates. However, the response seems to be late. This is not the x8 unfolding support FIIO talked about. I am not an expert, so I don't know about device logs. There is no reason I can fix this by going through it. This is definitely something that FIIO has to solve. I just want FIIO to live up to its promise from a consumer standpoint.

FiiO

When playing MQA tracks, the status bar will display the original sample rates of the MQA track instead of the playing sample rates after fully unfolding, as requested by the MQA licensor.

As you could see in the middle part of the other players, 88.2khz is showing up.

Best regards

Aclii

ppunji77 replied at 2021-1-25 09:29
Thank you for your reply and checking.
The reason is simple. It seems to be due to the MQA suppor ...

I'm just trying to say that internally M11 Pro does full x8 unfold, but as FiiO says due some license limitations (while M11 Pro is listed as playback device on the MQA site) they can only show original sample rate of the MQA file played. Logs maybe messy so here just few lines from them

MQA 48/24, 96 original sample rate, AK4497 DAC is configured to 384000kHz sample rate which is 48 x 8
AK4497 DAC configuration:

1. [254013.640585]  [3:     AudioOut_D: 2317] samsung-abox 14a50000.abox: rate=384000, width=32, channel=2, bclk=24576000

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MQA decoder configuration

1. 01-25 00:38:19.225  2247  2317 W audio_hw_primary_abox: mqa_pcm_open, mqa_pcmconfig.rate:384000

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Sample rate indicator update

1. 01-25 00:38:19.345  2671  2843 D PhoneStatusBar: sampleRateObserver sampleRate=384000 <- this one is probably hidden
   
2. 01-25 00:38:19.856  2671  2671 D PhoneStatusBar: originalRate=96000 audioType=2 <- This one we see on the status bar

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ppunji77

FiiO replied at 2021-1-25 17:05
When playing MQA tracks, the status bar will display the original sample rates of the MQA track inst ...

Thank you for your reply.
What you are talking about is what I already know. The reason I'm writing here is not to hear such a clerical answer, I've been using FIIO products for a long time and I'm an FIIO fan that I like.
So I hope it improves from a consumer's point of view. Consumers like me aren't experts and want to visually check if they really support x8 MQA.
I want to check the currently playing sample rate directly in the status bar.
Most of the other companies already support it, so why can't FIIO be implemented? Do I have to listen while checking the log to check MQA x8 unfolding? I don't think it's right.
However, I wrote in the hope that you will be considerate of consumers and improve them through firmware updates.
Thank you.

ppunji77

Aclii replied at 2021-1-25 23:01
I'm just trying to say that internally M11 Pro does full x8 unfold, but as FiiO says due some licen ...

Thank you for your reply.
I understand what you said. However, consumers like me aren't experts, so they want to visually see if they really support x8 MQA. I want to check the currently playing sample rate directly in the status bar. Most of the other companies already support it, so why can't FIIO be implemented? Do I have to listen while checking the log to check MQA x8 unfolding? I don't think it's right. However, I wrote in the hope that you will be considerate of consumers and improve them through firmware updates.

Thank you.